Opinions on smallest or least noticeable bracket

[melgreen]

Hi -

I'm a 43-year old single woman and in need of braces. I've put it off for years - and am still working up the courage. My teeth are not really that crowded but the issue is I have an open bite infront (can't make my top and bottom teeth meet) and I also have a few other issues (tiny overjet, posterior crossbite, general crowding). My dentist has been telling me for quite some time now that I really should get braces. I also have some TMJ discomfort which we attribute to stress and an improper bite.

I had braces as a kid for over 3 years - had a few teeth pulled (nowadays they probably would not have done that) - and rarely wore my retainers.

Over the past year or so, I've been on a few consults - just to sort of get an idea of my options. And - my decision will be based on who I trust and feel I can work with the best, location, hours, and total cost. Believe it or not I've found an over $3,000 range in price for treatment. And all have the same treatment time - of about 18 months. All included the same things too (records, adjustments, followup etc).

Anyway - I know it's not about the bracket used but the skill of the ortho, and any bracket will move your teeth it's the ortho who controls it - - - BUT

I'd like to hear from all of you adult patients out there to get your opinion on what bracket you feel is most esthetically pleasing and or LEAST noticeable.

I realize that no matter what, people will know I have braces. But I DO think some brackets are less noticeable then others.

I've seen tiny self ligating metal clips that look like they'd be less conspicuous but they are still metal. And I've seen 'clear' ceramics that look huge and clunky.

I'm not a big fan of the traditional ligatures - and so far I'm partial to self ligating simply because I don't want to deal with the changing of ligs each time, don't want to deal with them staining if I do go with ceramics etc. I'm also aware that some people choose a certain shade of gray or tooth color in order so the ligs stain less - but that won't fly with me. I love red wine and tomato sauce - - so I have a feeling I will be in trouble if I go that route.

BUT - - - if I thought traditional (with ligs) ceramic brackets were somehow smaller and looked better, I'd forego the wine and sauce for 18 months or be very careful or try to get in more often for lig changes.

Lastly - - this isn't about choosing the ortho I like best and going with what he/she offers. I live in an area of the country where I can probably find 5 orthos that would be 'best' but all offer a different bracket. So in this case I'm just wondering how others feel about how noticeable their braces are.

(I also know some of you don't care HOW they look - if that's the case, no need to respond. LOL.)

*I have rather small teeth and lips - so that is also why SIZE of bracket is a concern.

Thanks!
Melanie

[mikeg]

I would go with ceramic braces as they are less visible. The ICE braces brackets are very nice looking too as far as I have seen on this site.

You seem to know a lot about braces and I'm sure you'll make a good decision...

and FYI. I prefer self ligating also

[melgreen]

Thanks very much - regarding self ligating, I've been reading about a lot of people feeling pain when the 'door' is open and closed. I take it that is not the case for you?

I haven't met an ortho who offers the ICE braces. Infact so far I've only met one ortho who offers SL's and he uses a metal SL called "speed system" and the if I preferred ceramic SL's I think he uses the 3M Clarity but I'm not positive. He actually said that I'd probably be happier with the metal because they are that much tinier vs. the ceramic. So that really confused me. LOL

[Sunny]

3M clarity are a good bracket, although not as clear as the ice or sapphire.

I was 47 when I started treatment and the 'look' of the bracket was a huge issue for me also ... but after a few weeks I forgot about that, as I realised other people don't care about my mouth or what's happening in it. I was obsessed by it, but I had to accept it really wasn't important to others, who already have busy lives.

I've had both ceramic and metal brackets and I work with three orthodontists. We use ceramic, metal brackets and ibraces, plus one ortho treats using invisalign.

Out of the four types of treatment, ibraces are the only ones that can't be seen, due to them being bonded on the inside of the teeth. We have a few adults who've chose ibraces on top and ceramic on the lowers ... this is to keep their treatment as 'invisable' as they can.

Good luck finding the right ortho with the right brackets for you melgreen.

[melgreen]

Thanks for the response Sunny.

That is great that you've adjusted so well to your braces, how long has it been that you've had them on and when do they think they will come off?

>I was 47 when I started treatment and the 'look' of the bracket was a huge issue for me also ... but after a few weeks I forgot about that, as I realised other people don't care about my mouth or what's happening in it.

Wellllllllllllll I guess it depends on what circles you run in. LOL
I work for a very large company and I'm in a highly visible role. I know people will notice and comment on my braces - probably on a daily basis.

Plus I'm single - and I think one of the first things people look at when you meet them is your smile and teeth. So no doubt guys are going to notice my braces almost immediately. So IF I can select a bracket that will look just a little bit 'better' (and I use that term lightly) then another, I'm going to do just that. I'm not one of those people who believes braces look 'cute' or 'attractive' so I'll just have to suck it up while they are on and count the days until they come off - knowing it is so worth it to have a healthy bite.

I've read a great deal about ibraces (linguals) - I don't think I've met one ortho who will offer them, and when asked they are VERY critical of them. So not an option for me. (I swear I've met with about 9 different orthos over the last year and a half. Life situations have delayed my getting treatment. First I just chickened out, plain and simple. But then someone I love was in a very serious accident I've been dealing with that. He isn't going to be 'okay' so it's been a very sad and stressful time in my life.) I'm finally trying to move forward and focus on ME and my health - - but I'm still a bit on the fence with the ortho I will choose. No one really knocked my socks off - or gave me that feeling of trust and confidence - I've never had a harder time finding a doctor for anything else in my life the way I have with finding an ortho.

So have you always had clear brackets through your treatment or have you had ceramic and metal? Which is more comfy and less bulky? Which do you prefer?

Thanks again - Mel

[Sunny]

Thanks for the response Sunny.

That is great that you've adjusted so well to your braces, how long has it been that you've had them on and when do they think they will come off?

A long time ... over four years, due to my ortho having to change treatment plans several times. My case was complicated due to an impacted upper canine that refused to moved down and my edge to edge bite changing to a class III. My ortho is hopeful that my brackets will be removed in early 2010. My upper teeth won't look a lot different (although a couple of gaps are gone, some crowding and a crossbite), but my bite will work differently, plus my jaw pain is gone ... which is the best news!

Wellllllllllllll I guess it depends on what circles you run in. LOL
I work for a very large company and I'm in a highly visible role. I know people will notice and comment on my braces - probably on a daily basis.

I was working as a counsellor (which involved working one on one and with both small and large management groups), when I first got braces and my husband was the general manager of a large industry, so both my job and social life involved interactions with large numbers of people. I found (and believe) that the way I reacted had the biggest impact, as I never mentioned having braces and I didn't let them affect any of the things I did pre-braces. I'm sure this was reflected back to me, in that no one around me mentioned my braces. I also have worked in the prison system for a while and not one prisoner has made a negative comment ... again I'm sure due to the way I don't react to having braces. Now I'm working for my ortho and his two business partners ... and I talk to all our adult patients about having ortho treatment.

Plus I'm single - and I think one of the first things people look at when you meet them is your smile and teeth. So no doubt guys are going to notice my braces almost immediately. So IF I can select a bracket that will look just a little bit 'better' (and I use that term lightly) then another, I'm going to do just that. I'm not one of those people who believes braces look 'cute' or 'attractive' so I'll just have to suck it up while they are on and count the days until they come off - knowing it is so worth it to have a healthy bite.

I'm sure you know about plenty about shallow people, and if a guy is so shallow as to be concerned that you're taking such a huge step to fix a problem about yourself ... be grateful he didn't take a second look! Another important thing to remember is ... the time of your treatment will usually only be around two years ... so please focus on how quickly that will pass. I'm also single now ... due to my beloved soul mate dying nine months ago.

I've read a great deal about ibraces (linguals) - I don't think I've met one ortho who will offer them, and when asked they are VERY critical of them.

The ortho's I work with have great success with linguals, but they're definitely not for everyone, as they do take a bit more effort to work on. We find it's usually top line executives who do the best with them, probably because they're the most motivated.

(I swear I've met with about 9 different orthos over the last year and a half. Life situations have delayed my getting treatment. First I just chickened out, plain and simple.

This sounds very similar to what happens to many (if not most) adults. We know we need to do something, but it's not as easy as that. My journey into checking out the world of orthdontics started about 30 years ago when my dentist explained the problems that could eventuate due to having an impacted canine. Until then, I just thought the 'baby' tooth was always going to stay. Then about 10 years ago I started to get jaw pain and that's when I started to consult with a variety of orthodontist's. During the years that followed we moved to three countries and I kept checking out my options. Finally after moving to South Australia five years ago, and meeting an amazing orthodontist (who I now work for), I just knew the timing was right.

But then someone I love was in a very serious accident I've been dealing with that. He isn't going to be 'okay' so it's been a very sad and stressful time in my life.)

I'm really sorry you've had to have this happen in your life. When my soulmate died on the last day of summer this year ... I didn't know how I would live without him. It's only his strength surging through me that is getting me through at this time. I know I'll get stronger ... and I hold firmly to that!

So have you always had clear brackets through your treatment or have you had ceramic and metal? Which is more comfy and less bulky? Which do you prefer?

My ceramic brackets were opaque, which was great, as my teeth have the 'aged' look and are far from clear. I had them on my front five teeth ... due to only having one canine ... and they were great. We offer six ceramic brackets at no extra charge to all our patients and I can't remember when someone didn't say 'yes'! The ceramic brackets have a larger footprint ... that means they're bigger in size, but no higher off the tooth. This also means they're more comfortable ... the way we explain this to patients is ... think about one thin stick poking your arm, then think how that would feel if it was still one stick, but a lot thicker. The thicker stick covers a wider area, therefore the 'poke' is spread over a larger area and the feeling is less. Small brackets are usually the most pokey/scratchy ones and take longer to adjust to. I've tried a two different kinds ... and I was relieved when my 'guinea pig' status was over and I could get back to brackets that had a larger footprint and had the nice rounded edges.

Hope that helps. I realise the stage you're in is a tough one, and it can be really confusing, especially with so much advertising pushing one thing over another. I'm hoping that when you find the right orthodontist, you'll be fine and happy to be treated by whatever they offer.

I wish you luck with your teeth and your future!

[melgreen]

Hi Sunny - I remember reading on here that your husband passed months back. I am so very very sorry for your loss. Your a strong person - and sound like you are dealing with your grief the best way possible. And you continue to help so many on here- your an inspiration!

Regarding the ceramics - - - I've seen the In-vu on one patient, an ortho I met with a while back had an adult patient with them on. I suppose it must have to do with the lig staining as well as the general color of the tooth, but in this particular individual the brackets looked dreadful. Her teeth looked very yellow - I was shocked.

I'm sure I'll make the right choice - - and I'll keep you posted on what I decide.

Thanks again and all the best to you in your braces journey - I'm guessing you must very close to being debraced by now!

[Sunny]

I started with Clarity's 3M brackets. The one InVu I have now, is just a trial bracket ... and if you look at the pics of my teeth, you'll see there's no yellow shading ... probably because I never use ligs that stain. The in-vu is quite a small ceramic bracket and no wear as comfy as the 3M brackets ... but I was well into my treatment when my ortho got me to try it ... and it's done ok for me.

I think you can be certain that the yellow colour was either badly stained ligs or maybe the bonding stained by a person who smokes.

Good luck with getting your journey started. I hope you soon find the ortho who'll be able to treat your bite.

Thanks for your message about my husband ... it's been a long 9 months ... I miss him more than I could imagine ... and I feel more love for him than ever. We had an amazing life and for that I'll always be grateful!

[melgreen]

"I started with Clarity's 3M brackets. The one InVu I have now, is just a trial bracket ... and if you look at the pics of my teeth, you'll see there's no yellow shading ... probably because I never use ligs that stain. The in-vu is quite a small ceramic bracket and no wear as comfy as the 3M brackets ... but I was well into my treatment when my ortho got me to try it ... and it's done ok for me. I think you can be certain that the yellow colour was either badly stained ligs or maybe the bonding stained by a person who smokes."

I'll have to take a look at your photos again. I do recall them telling me this woman was a big coffee drinker - but so am I. And I really don't want to worry about what color ligs to try, etc - seems no matter what color people with ceramics choose, if they eat anything colored (tomato sauce, red wine, coffee, tea, curry) the lig stains in a variety of ways based on the lig color. I know there is an option of wire ties in some instances - not all orthos will do that though.

Also seems to be a matter of personal preference and some ceramics just look BETTER on certain people based on the size of their teeth to begin with, color of their teeth compared to bracket, etc etc.

It is interesting you see such a huge difference in comfort in the In-vu vs. the Clarity. You would think the makers of these brackets would all follow a similiar theory and make them as comfy as possible!

One ortho I met with - uses Inovation-C for his patients who want ceramic. I know those are SL's - do you know anyone on here who is happy with those brackets? That said - he said I might be happier with all metal, as he uses a micro metal bracket on the social 6 that is very small. I've read some say smaller the bracket the more pain, but that doesn't frighten me.

Take care! Keep you posted. Mel

[melgreen]

Hi Sunny - I wanted to give you an update on my consult tonight. I know I've read on here that the larger the bracket as it pertains to space it takes up on the tooth, the less overall discomfort because the pressure is more evenly distributed across the entire tooth.

I asked the ortho about this tonight and he assured me this is NOT the case with the brackets he uses. The brackets (metal) used on my front four teeth are miniscule - really really tiny, and then the rest will be slightly larger but still so much smaller then the brackets used with ligs.

He prefes working with the metal on the front top teeth vs. ceramic (Inovation-C) - he just feels the metal are stronger and he even thinks the micro mini bracket are more aesthetically pleasing. But he will do whatever I choose.

I suppose I'm a little nervous because as it is explained to me - there is no way to know for sure how my teeth will move. He said initially they just straighten my teeth but to correct my open bite and to correct my cross bite in the back, it all depends on how my teeth respond.

We discussed a variety of possibilities from possibly pushing some of my rear molars back IN (i forget the term) to allow for my bite to close infront, to TADs, and even extraction of my wisdom teeth to make more room. Just seemed as though it would all be a sort of wait and see how my teeth move. And he can't predict how they will behave - he said that is why he thinks all these new computer generated programs are useless. It might be great to see how they'd like your teeth to look but it doesn't mean that will be the result.

Here is an article on the brackets he uses, it is an interview with the inventor so naturally he'll be a bit biased. I've not seen these brackets offered anywhere else and rarely spoken about on any of the discussion lists here or on arch wired:

JCO Interviews Dr. G. Herbert Hanson on the SPEED Bracket - Journal of Clinical Orthodontics

[Sunny]

Sounds like your ortho is being very thorough, as he's right about there being no way to know in advance how teeth will move. This has affected my treatment twice, but with a good ortho, a new treatment plan can be worked on. The guys I work for feel the same about the computer generated movement as your ortho does.

The speed bracket has been around for quite some time and although I've never seen anyone with them, they look similar (but not the same) as many of the metal brackets that are used. They are reported to be pokey, due to their size, but like all brackets ... the wearer adjusts quickly. I'm not sure why they're not used by more ortho's.

Has your ortho shown you the innovation C brackets? We had them sent to us to check out when we were considering changing brackets. The three ortho's I work with, liked the style and shape of the bracket, but due to it's size and the metal clip, all three rejected it. I've seen it on the same teeth moulds as clarity 3M, clarity smart clips and TP InVu.

If you check the photo albums on this site, you'll see the innovation C's on Andromeda. Her final results were good!

Here's to you soon feeling ready to commit to your treatment and you being thrilled with the outcome!

[melgreen]

Thanks Sunny!!!

He mentioned only placing ceramics or micro-mini brackets on my front FOUR teeth, isn't it usually the social 6 or front 6? You definitely can see all 6 of my front teeth very clearly.

>Sounds like your ortho is being very thorough, as he's right about there being no way to know in advance how teeth will move. This has affected my treatment twice, but with a good ortho, a new treatment plan can be worked on. The guys I work for feel the same about the computer generated movement as your ortho does.

He also said if I REALLY wanted to try Invisalign we could try it - but if it didn't work, I'd need braces and it would extend my visit. Also - Invisalign is $1,000 more. Invisalign turns me off anyway - having those things covering your teeth all the time, so I have no desire to try that, just as well.

>The speed bracket has been around for quite some time and although I've never seen anyone with them, they look similar (but not the same) as many of the metal brackets that are used.

Really?? Do you mean similiar to other self ligating? So far I have never seen a bracket so small (traditional or SL) offered by any other ortho I met with.

>They are reported to be pokey, due to their size, but like all brackets ... the wearer adjusts quickly. I'm not sure why they're not used by more ortho's.

Wonder why people feel they are pokey - given their size I'd say they are much less so. I felt them with my finger and compared them to brackets with ligs that he had a model of - no difference accept much much smaller.

>Has your ortho shown you the innovation C brackets? We had them sent to us to check out when we were considering changing brackets. The three ortho's I work with, liked the style and shape of the bracket, but due to it's size and the metal clip, all three rejected it. I've seen it on the same teeth moulds as clarity 3M, clarity smart clips and TP InVu.

Yes - but they were in a case, not on an actual model of teeth - so not easy to actually see. I will say they look much nicer to me then the Invus I've seen on an actual person and on a model of teeth. The tiny bit of metal in the bracket did not bother me - but again he said he thinks they look lousy and are very bulky - a concern of mine given I have a small mouth.

>If you check the photo albums on this site, you'll see the innovation C's on Andromeda. Her final results were good!

Yup I saw them, very nice results - but they do appear large on her teeth.

>Here's to you soon feeling ready to commit to your treatment and you being thrilled with the outcome!

Thanks - I have one more consult with an ortho who offers traditional brackets with ligs next week and then I will decide.

What are your thoughts on people saying that a smaller bracket on the tooth causes more pain and this ortho saying that is not accurate?
Thank you again!

[melgreen]

It's also interesting to see various people who have ceramics on top and bottom. I've had ever ortho I've met REFUSE to put them on the bottom for fear I will chip a top tooth on the lower bracket. All but ONE ortho who said he would indeed put them on the bottom for me. LOL - but I would not risk it.

[Sunny]

We put ceramic brackets on the top six ... called the social six, as they can be seen most easily when a person is smiling. If a person wants more than the social six, then there is a small charge, as the ceramic brackets are more expensive.

About the feel of a bracket ... remember how tough the skin on your finger is compared to the inside of your mouth. But ... your mouth will adjust to whatever brackets you have ... so don't fret over that one. I've had a patient who transferred to our practice who had quite a small sl bracket. She'd said they took less than a month to adjust to with loads of wax and mouth sore gel. Some people find it takes a similar time with the larger brackets, although most adjust within two weeks ... as long as they use wax and warm salt water rinses etc ... to look after the inside of their mouth.

What are your thoughts on people saying that a smaller bracket on the tooth causes more pain and this ortho saying that is not accurate?

Maybe the ortho has no personal experience of wearing different brackets, or having staff (or people he trusts) report back as to how it really does feel. Some ortho's are commited to using a particular brand of bracket and as they know that brackets don't affect treatment, they may choose to ignore any of the other negatives, as they want to treat people and make their bite better, regardless. I doubt it's a person being deliberately dishonest ... more in line with a 'white' lie. lol Also ... all good ortho's will know that a person adjusts quickly to any and all brackets ... so it's not a major issue in the overall person, if this is what the patient wants to hear.

I've got to be honest that of the brackets I've seen, innovation c are the largest ceramic one. Personally I thought the front brackets looked ok, but the side brackets made me think of crabs ... in the sea animal, due to the large hooks they have. Some of the other staff laughed at me when I said that ... but most also agreed. I'm sure that unless someone is staring at your teeth ... and hopefully no one other than you and your ortho have that type of interest, they wouldn't notice any of the ceramic brackets. The first time I had black ligs, I was sure that my hubby would comment, but he didn't ... I had to tell him and even then he didn't believe me. Oh well ... a reminder that what seems glaringly obvious to us, isn't to others.

I've seen both non sl and sl that are similar in size to the speed bracket. Some of the non sl are tiny ... almost annoyingly so, as they do get to a point that it's almost micro surgery to work with them ... which takes longer than the slightly larger more commonly used brackets.

It's also interesting to see various people who have ceramics on top and bottom.

The wearing of ceramics on upper and lowers is quite common, but it does depend on the person's bite. The ceramic brackets are very hard and the ortho won't want a patient to knock their teeth on them, as this can cause the tooth to chip. Therefore if the ortho considers your bite may do this, they would recommend the metal brackets on the lower teeth. If a patient still is totally against this and is prepared to risk ceramic brackets on the lower teeth, there are things called 'bumpers' that can be put on those teeth, until the bite is opened enough that the risk is gone. A few patients have the metal brackets until their bite is better and then get the ceramic ones ... but the majority go with what their ortho recommends.

Good luck with your consult next week! Be confident that you'll soon make the best decision for you! Take care!

[Desy_dawn]

If I were you, I would try and find a doctor who does iBraces. I have had mine on for over a month and have had rapid changes. The whole reason I got them is that I had a baby canine that never came out and the other was fully in behind it. The tooth as moved almost all the way into place and had to have an emergency vist to my ortho yesterday to have the "blank" removed. The whole office was thrilled with the progress! Alot of people complain about the pain of iBraces and to be honest, I haven't hardly had any issues with them after the first four days. No one knows that I have them. I am infront of customers all the time and I have only had one person ask about it. I don't think he would have noticed if I hadn't worked with him so much over the last 6 years! I also like the fact that everyone can't see all the food in your teeth right after you eat. I am just really weird about things like that!

Good luck on your search!

[melgreen]

Hi Sunny and thanks - for all the reassuring and great info (as always!!)

>Maybe the ortho has no personal experience of wearing different brackets, or having staff (or people he trusts) report back as to how it really does feel. Some ortho's are commited to using a particular brand of bracket and as they know that brackets don't affect treatment, they may choose to ignore any of the other negatives, as they want to treat people and make their bite better, regardless.

This is an excellent point and I'm sure very true!

>I've got to be honest that of the brackets I've seen, innovation c are the largest ceramic one. Personally I thought the front brackets looked ok, but the side brackets made me think of crabs ... in the sea animal, due to the large hooks they have.

I had a similiar reaction when seeing photos of them on a patient - when I was shown them in the office they were in a little tray, not on an actual tooth - so it was hard for me to tell.

>I've seen both non sl and sl that are similar in size to the speed bracket. Some of the non sl are tiny ... almost annoyingly so, as they do get to a point that it's almost micro surgery to work with them ... which takes longer than the slightly larger more commonly used brackets.

I wonder if this depends on the country? I've met with a large # of orthos and not one had a traditional or SL bracket that was anywhere NEARLY as small as the micro-mini in the speed system.

>The wearing of ceramics on upper and lowers is quite common, but it does depend on the person's bite. The ceramic brackets are very hard and the ortho won't want a patient to knock their teeth on them, as this can cause the tooth to chip. Therefore if the ortho considers your bite may do this, they would recommend the metal brackets on the lower teeth. If a patient still is totally against this and is prepared to risk ceramic brackets on the lower teeth, there are things called 'bumpers' that can be put on those teeth, until the bite is opened enough that the risk is gone. A few patients have the metal brackets until their bite is better and then get the ceramic ones ... but the majority go with what their ortho recommends.

Have had only one out of about 10 orthos (over the past year and a half when I began consulting) tell me he would do top and bottom and I'd never touch or hit a tooth. I wouldn't take the risk though - and when I talk and smile my lower teeth do not show.

Thanks again - keep you posted!

Have a very Happy Thanksgiving!
Mel

[melgreen]

Thanks for the suggestion but based on all my research on linguals, patient and ortho feedback - I would never go with them. In addition many orthos won't use them due to the difficulty in achieving what is necessary.

That said - it is great you are happy with yours!

Take care - Mel

If I were you, I would try and find a doctor who does iBraces. I have had mine on for over a month and have had rapid changes. The whole reason I got them is that I had a baby canine that never came out and the other was fully in behind it. The tooth as moved almost all the way into place and had to have an emergency vist to my ortho yesterday to have the "blank" removed. The whole office was thrilled with the progress! Alot of people complain about the pain of iBraces and to be honest, I haven't hardly had any issues with them after the first four days. No one knows that I have them. I am infront of customers all the time and I have only had one person ask about it. I don't think he would have noticed if I hadn't worked with him so much over the last 6 years! I also like the fact that everyone can't see all the food in your teeth right after you eat. I am just really weird about things like that!

Good luck on your search!

[Sunny]

I wonder if this depends on the country? I've met with a large # of orthos and not one had a traditional or SL bracket that was anywhere NEARLY as small as the micro-mini in the speed system.

I've seen both non sl and sl that are similar in size to the speed bracket. Some of the non sl are tiny ... almost annoyingly so, as they do get to a point that it's almost micro surgery to work with them ... which takes longer than the slightly larger more commonly used brackets.

I don't think it's country, but more about the choice of company/s the ortho goes with. The three ortho's I work for will not use micro brackets, but instead use a small metal bracket, which is the one I've got on my teeth. The also won't use sl, due to the problems some patients are having with orthodontists/dentists over using these to round the arches (as in the advertising of the product), when a person should be having an expander, or for an adult SARPE. The result of over rounding is that the roots of the teeth have minimal jaw bone to hold them in place. The archwires of course can be used to do this with ligating, but we’ve not heard of this, so think that it’s mostly done to keep with the advertising of the product.

I took notice last night when I went to a large supermarket to buy groceries ... many young people work in these supermarkets after school ... I'm not confident of all of the brands, but I know I saw ... TP, speed, a coupe of damon3 and MX, 3M (smart clip), GAC (in-ovation), ormco (inspire) ... and more, some I have no idea what brand they'd be. Ceramic varieties were the most common as were ligating. I felt a bit like a spy ... but your posts made me think about what the other ortho's in the city I work in use on their patients. We get transferring patients, but usually from outside out area ... so this was an interesting experience.

Desy_dawn where I work, we have one ortho trained to use ibraces and he's having amazing success. There hasn't been a case he's not been able to treat with confidence and his patients love what he does and how he does it. His chair time is similar to the other two orthos. I think with most things ... it's about training ... and if you're skilled after the training ... you'll do as good a job with that product, as with any other.


Good luck with your experience being such a positive one!

[melgreen]

[QUOTE=Sunny;13182]I don't think it's country, but more about the choice of company/s the ortho goes with. The three ortho's I work for will not use micro brackets, but instead use a small metal bracket, which is the one I've got on my teeth. The also won't use sl, due to the problems some patients are having with orthodontists/dentists over using these to round the arches (as in the advertising of the product), when a person should be having an expander, or for an adult SARPE. The result of over rounding is that the roots of the teeth have minimal jaw bone to hold them in place. The archwires of course can be used to do this with ligating, but we’ve not heard of this, so think that it’s mostly done to keep with the advertising of the product.

Wow all that is way over my head - LOL.
I'll leave that stuff up to the ortho to worry about and trust that if he uses SL brackets, he isn't over rounding my arches. I do know that some of the better known orthos (and board certified) in my area DO indeed use SLs.
So I'm sure as so many say - it is all about the skill and expertise of the ortho - not the type of bracket.


Amazing you were able to see that many kids with braces in your supermarket - and observe ALL those types of brackets. Orthodontia sure is popular in your area! Also interesting that the linguals are being used a lot in your office too - as in my area all the orthos said they are really not used, sort of were a fad and then went away because they were not successful.
I don't believe it had anything to do with lack of training but more a lack of happy patients and success. I can't imagine having my tongue rub against them all day long. But it would be nice from an anesthetic point of view!

Take care and thks again for the info!
Mel

[Sunny]

Mel I was thinking about you and hoping all is well.

I've got something I need to ask, considering your issue with ligatures and their staining etc. Have the ortho's you've consulted with talked to you about needing to use powerchains? I've realised this hasn't come up in our discussions and that most people, although not all, need powerchains at some stage during treatment. For me ... it was ligs for about six months, and it's been powerchains since then. They're amazing, as they hold teeth together and move them in groups, rather than individually. The reason I was thinking about powerchains and you ... is since the ligature thing is bothering you so much ... powerchains are really just a row of ligatures that are joined together. They're made of the same, stain the same and are used with both sl and non sl brackets.

If you need them ... you need to be aware of this. I hope you'll adjust to your brackets whatever they are, once your treatment has started, and with that most people rarely notice much more, other than the movement of their teeth ... which is really exciting!

Like your comment ... I was amazed how many of the young ones at this supermarket had braces. I've never really looked before, but I decided to, just to see what types of brackets kids are wearing. This was a huge supermarket, and I doubt I would have seen half the staff. Plus I went there after work, which means nearly every counter is open, coz so many other's drop in to gets a few bits and pieces on there way home from work.

Australia is up their with the leaders when it comes to orthodontic work ... especially with the work being done at university level. Adult orthodontics is still not very common, mostly due to 'how teeth look', not really being an issue here. I'm happy we mostly don't have the 'hollywood' fever look ... as it's hard explaining to teenagers that it's rarely achievable with orthodontics ... it takes cosmetic work (expensive), and loads of photo-shoping!

[melgreen]

QUOTE=Sunny;13213]I've got something I need to ask, considering your issue with ligatures and their staining etc. Have the ortho's you've consulted with talked to you about needing to use powerchains?

Nope. Not one ever mentioned a powerchain. I'm familiar with what they are - but no one ever mentioned them to me, doesn't mean I won't need them though.

>Australia is up their with the leaders when it comes to orthodontic work ... especially with the work being done at university level.

Really? Never knew that! Learn something new every day.

>Adult orthodontics is still not very common, mostly due to 'how teeth look', not really being an issue here.

Well as you would imagine - the USA is as advanced in orthodontia as other countries and adult orthodontia is VERY popular. But I don't know that it is so much about looks, as you say people have the options for bonding and veneers for minor problems. I'm not against that either - I think everyone has a different situation and need. I've seen absolutely beautiful veneer work done and with proper care, they can last a lifetime. That said - bonding and veneers would not solve my problem as assuredly as orthodontia will. And a lot of adults want both - correction for health reasons as well as looks.

> I'm happy we mostly don't have the 'hollywood' fever look ... as it's hard explaining to teenagers that it's rarely achievable with orthodontics ... it takes cosmetic work (expensive), and loads of photo-shoping!

It sure is here!!! You can't photo shop someone when your looking at them in person. I have 7 nieces and nephews who have all had braces and ALL have gorgeous hollywood smiles.

Take care - I'll touch base with you once I'm braced. Perhaps that will be by end of year.

Mel

[melgreen]

And thanks again as always for your input and opinions - they help a great deal!!

[rachie9415]

yeah i would go with ceramics. their not very noticible. a friend of mine asked me if i had gotten my braces taken off because she couldnt see them! ( which they were of course still on) so i suggest those